the big bang

The non amateur stuff. Hawking, black holes, that sort of thing

Moderators: joe, Brian, Guy Fennimore

chris ide
Posts: 20
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 7:43 pm
Contact:

the big bang

Post by chris ide »

Hi all,
here is a poser for anyone interested, it is widely agreed that there was a big bang that formed the universe , it also would appear that the universe is expanding at a phenominal rate because of the big bang ,
so does this mean that our planet ,sun ,milky way is also travelling through space at this incredible rate, i assume away from the centre of the big bang . if this is correct is it not possible to find out where in space the big bang took place, just a thought.
Chris
(thick bricklayer) :roll:
stella
Posts: 1473
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 2:41 pm
Location: 55° 57'N: 03° 08'W
Contact:

Big Bang

Post by stella »

The Big Bang took place everywhere since the Universe was confined to a point singularity. There is no 'centre' to the Bang. Every galaxy cluster sees every other cluster moving away from them. :arrow:
joe
Site Admin
Posts: 4382
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 11:24 am
Location: Greenwich, London
Contact:

Post by joe »

I think anyone thinking about the Big Bang should always bear in mind that this was a phrase dreamt up by Fred Hoyle as a joke at the expense of a theory to which he did not subscribe. He was one of a few astronomers who thought that the universe was continually creating matter and therefore had always existed. In fact there was no big bang in the sense of an explosion at a point in space from which everything, debris, is flying away. The Big Bang was the beginning of the expansion of space.

In this 100th anniversary year of Albert Einstein maybe a new name for the beginning should be proposed. No disrespect meant to the late Professor Hoyle. :)
200mm Newtonian, OMC140, ETX90, 15x70 Binoculars.
chris ide
Posts: 20
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 7:43 pm
Contact:

Post by chris ide »

HI ALL ,
THANKS STELLA AND JOE , I SAW A PROGRAME THIS MORNING ON DISCOVERY SCIENCE , HAWKINS ON THE B BANG VERY INTERESTING , THEY SHOWED THE EXPANDING UNIVERSE AS A BALLOON BEING BLOWN UP(LETS HOPE IT NEVER POPS).
BUT NO ONE HAS AWNSERED ONE QUESTION WE MUST ALSO BE HURTLING THROUGH SPACE , COULD THIS EVER BE MEASURED , I SUPPOSE MAYBE NOT AS WE HAVE NOTHING (A FIXED POINT) TO MEASURE AGAINST.
CHRIS
stella
Posts: 1473
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 2:41 pm
Location: 55° 57'N: 03° 08'W
Contact:

Hurtling Thru' Space

Post by stella »

Yes, the Earth is moving through space, but as you say, we need a reference point against which to measure it. The Earth is orbiting the Sun at about 29.8 km/second, relative to the Sun. The Sun (and its family of planets) is believed to be moving at 19.5 km/second towards a point in the constellation of Hercules. This is measured relative to the centre of our Milky Way galaxy.
:roll:
joe
Site Admin
Posts: 4382
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 11:24 am
Location: Greenwich, London
Contact:

Post by joe »

Hi Chris,

Ditto stella. We are hurtling through space... or other things are hurtling passed us. You can only measure something relative to something else. If you were the only object in the whole universe, the ONLY one, then your size would be COMPLETELY meaningless, as would be your motion and your position. 8)
200mm Newtonian, OMC140, ETX90, 15x70 Binoculars.
chris ide
Posts: 20
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 7:43 pm
Contact:

Post by chris ide »

HI JOE, STELLA, ALL,
YOU SAY WE ARE HURTLING TOWARDS HERCULES , BUT SURELY HERCULES IS HEADING AWAY FROM US ASWELL? ALSO WHAT ARE YOU VEIWS OF LIFE ON OTHER PLANETS, IT STRIKES ME THAT SAY 1 BILLION STARS IN OUR GALAXY AND ANOTHER BILLION GALAXIES THERE MUST BE , HAS TO BE LIFE ON ANOTHER PLANET THAT ORBITS ALL THESE STARS, OR MAYBE OURS IS THE ONLY GALAXY LEFT BECAUSE AFTER ALL WE ARE LOOKING AT OBJECTS THAT EXISTED 2 MILLION YEARS AGO(ANDROMEDA EXAMPLE) FOR ALL WE NO THEY MAY NOT EVEN EXIST NOW .
IT GETS VERY DEEP THIS STUFF I WISH WE JUST KNEW.
CHRIS
stella
Posts: 1473
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 2:41 pm
Location: 55° 57'N: 03° 08'W
Contact:

Post by stella »

No, Chris. Hercules is just the DIRECTION. Ii does not refer to any objects in that constellation.
joe
Site Admin
Posts: 4382
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 11:24 am
Location: Greenwich, London
Contact:

Post by joe »

Chris, you think about very interesting things. I think it is good to get a grasp of how far away other things are, even within our solar system but especially inter galactically, and also how much of an influence life has had and will have in the short period of time that we know it has been around. As you say, there is no way of knowing that a galaxy 2 million light years away still exists, but really, if we knew that we were going to disappear in 2 million years, would we panic, or adjust our outlook accordingly? I think we would have to step outside of ourselves to get a grasp of what that meant. I have to say though that after 13 billion years of observation, sorry 100 years of observing 13 billion years of information, there is no visual evidence that shows that whole galaxies commit hari kari. Look up, google, the Drake equation ( N = R* x fp x ne x fl x fi x fc x L ), it looks a bit scary but it is very simple and gives you a bit of an idea about the possibility of life elsewhere in the galaxy.

http://www.activemind.com/Mysterious/To ... ation.html
Last edited by joe on Tue Jan 18, 2005 12:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
200mm Newtonian, OMC140, ETX90, 15x70 Binoculars.
Phil Rice
Posts: 182
Joined: Sun Dec 19, 2004 4:27 pm
Location: Surrey
Contact:

Post by Phil Rice »

In relation to life "out there", I think it is out there but is unable to make contact as in the question posed by the Fermi paradox, namely if life is out there why haven't we been contacted. This question I beleive was answered in part by a Horizon programme earlier this week on Global Dimming. Essentially we do not appear to have that much time left as a species. Earth, when we have finished with it, will be inherited by other species, uanble to make contact as the technology required to to be able to transmit and listen brings along other problems resulting in extinction.

Best wishes

Phil Rice
Richard McC
Posts: 63
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 5:50 pm
Location: Outside Chester, United Kingdom
Contact:

ET existence

Post by Richard McC »

Absence of evidence is NOT evidence of absence!
Go placidly amidst the noise and haste, and remember what peace there is in silence....(and true darkness, without cloud cover).
joe
Site Admin
Posts: 4382
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 11:24 am
Location: Greenwich, London
Contact:

Post by joe »

Yes but evidently absence of evidence is THE NEXT BEST THING TO evidence of absence whose absence evidently can't be proven anyway. :shock:
200mm Newtonian, OMC140, ETX90, 15x70 Binoculars.
Richard McC
Posts: 63
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 5:50 pm
Location: Outside Chester, United Kingdom
Contact:

Post by Richard McC »

.......OK........I think! :shock:
Go placidly amidst the noise and haste, and remember what peace there is in silence....(and true darkness, without cloud cover).
cowait
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 2:26 pm
Location: yorkshire uk
Contact:

Post by cowait »

One of the most obvious reasons why we may not have been contacted might be that life is simply super abundant throughout the universe. So abundant in fact that just one more planet with yet another life form wriggling about on it is barely noticable.
Then again who is to say we haven't been visited? Lets face it the current thinking with regards to 'lost tribes' or 'pristine environments' is to leave well alone. Much of the debate on exploring hitherto isolated environments is to do with how not to contaminate such places. If we have decided that is the correct thing to do I am sure an alien species might come to the same conclusion.
Then again we might just be alone..............is that more scary?
joe
Site Admin
Posts: 4382
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 11:24 am
Location: Greenwich, London
Contact:

Post by joe »

Perhaps cowait, but I think the obvious reason why we have not been contacted by an alien species is that it is highly unlikely, for a whole number of reasons. And this is even assuming there is life out there capable of transmitting/receiving/leaving home planet.

Regards,
200mm Newtonian, OMC140, ETX90, 15x70 Binoculars.
Post Reply